The following transcript has been edited for length and readability. Listen to the entire discussion here on The Broadband Bunch. The Broadband Bunch is sponsored by ETI Software.
Pete Pizzutillo:
This episode of the Broadband Bunch is sponsored by ETI Software and Vetro FiberMap.
Hello and welcome again to another episode of the Broadband Bunch. My name is Pete Pizzutillo, and I am joined today by Joe Pellegrini.
Joe, how are you?
Joe Pellegrini:
Good, Pete. I appreciate you jumping on this morning.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, thanks for joining us. Joe is the President and Chief Operating Officer of Great Plains Communications.
And Joe, before we get into all that’s going on there, maybe you can help us understand your journey. You just recently took on this new role, but you’ve been in the business for quite a while. Just help us understand how you got here.
Joe Pellegrini:
Absolutely, I appreciate the question. It’s definitely been a telecom journey for me. I started back in the day at Southern New England Telephone, back in New England, Connecticut. I kind of cut my teeth on the line as a splicer and worked up through the ranks. And I jumped into working for FiberTech. Then FiberTech was purchased by Lightower. Lightower was purchased by Crown Castle, and I stepped away from Crown Castle knowing I wasn’t really interested in being part of kind of the big business field. I had a terrific opportunity with EverStream. Now we’re at Great Plains.
So I tell everybody as we sit around the table, those of us who’ve been at it 20, 25 years, and it’s kind of fun who’s been where and how long were you there and stuff like that. So it seems like none of us go away. We just kind of get a chance to work and learn in a different place. It’s been a terrific telecom journey; it really has.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, I think you’re right. It’s a small, big world out there. Similarly, Great Plains has been on a journey as well. Maybe you can kind of walk us through the history quickly. What milestones do you think have shaped where you are today, not you, but the company in general, in terms of the current success?
Joe Pellegrini:
Yeah, absolutely. Great Plains, it’s a wonderful business with a great history. It is a 113-year-old company that’s really been in the delivery of broadband and telecom services for an extended period of time. And really what that allows them and us to have is a really good understanding of the constituencies, right? The customer we’re trying to serve and who we are as a business.
And I would say that one of the biggest things that Great Plains brings to the table is a real understanding of who we are. A lot of folks out there, you know, they’ve been in business two, three, five, seven years, whatever it may be. They get a whole bunch of PE money, run out, and start a business. And you can be successful at that; you really can. But you’re developing who you are on the fly. What’s really terrific about Great Plains is they understand. We’re a slightly higher-cost business in terms of we serve a lot of the rural space.
And so, you know, understanding the timeframes and the geology and the local municipalities, the power companies, as well as the state legislature and the federal piece and how it affects the states that we’re in is a hallmark of the business. It really, really is. And it’s been terrific. I’ve been with the company just shy of two years right now. And I had a really nice opportunity when I first came in to not have a whole ton of stuff piled on from day one, so I could really learn the business, be able to travel to every single one of our outposts, and spend time with folks and learn about how the business has changed over the years and how we deliver those services.
I’m sure you talk to a lot of folks in the space like this, but I mean, since about late 2021, we have increased our internet traffic by 125%. So we’re doubling every two-and-a-half years or so. And so with that, you know, understanding all the different backplane pieces and the network upgrades and all the other pieces that go into that. Now, it’s been a terrific place to step into as it’s got such a rich history and an understanding of the business, who they are, and really how to serve those customers effectively.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, thank you for that. So 113 years, that’s crazy long. You know, there are not a lot of companies that have been around that long. This is an established, family-run company, and you finally got some private equity outside funding coming in. Now, what’s it like navigating that kind of dynamic between both the PE side as well as the kind of legacy organization?
Joe Pellegrini:
Great Plains has been on a journey for I would say the last 20 years in terms of really becoming a more CLEC-style business. So it wasn’t just when private equity came in back in 2018 or 2019. But they were really fortunate to get some large tower contracts in late 2008, 2010, and 2012. I think there were three different sets of them. 2012 was the biggest. But it really set them on a journey of growing the business and growing the physical asset in terms of a presence outside of those more legacy areas and into some new areas to serve the tower business.
And that sets off a bunch of different triggers because now that you’re in this new space you start discussing expanding and delivering fiber to the home. Let’s deliver to the enterprise. Let’s see what other opportunities in terms of wholesale there are. And so they’ve been on that path and on that journey. And I think that’s what made them so interesting to Grain Management at the time. Grain saw that they could come in with their strong portfolio and understanding of the tower and the telecom side of the business with different portfolio companies that they have and say, “We can take GPC and continue their progress and their growth in this space as opposed to trying to kickstart them from day one.”
Todd Foje, the CEO, I think he’s been CEO since 2008. And so he’s had a really clear path in his mind of where he wanted the business to go. And they’ve been working very methodically and thoughtfully toward that over a bunch of years to get kind of where we are today, for sure.
Pete Pizzutillo:
What about the cultural issues? We’ll talk about this a little bit later on kind of this watershed moment within broadband. And a lot of folks are opting out because there’s a lot of hard work ahead. And they’ve been doing it for long periods of time. So what is in the DNA of Great Plains that you think has kind of helped transition through bringing in new money and having a growth mentality?
Joe Pellegrini:
Yeah, I would say a couple of different pieces. One is really the people, right? As cliche as that may be, there are folks who have been with Great Plains for 15, 20, 25, 30 years. And they become not just the historians of the business and where it has been and where it can maybe go, but really they help you bring in new folks and ingrain them in the culture and continue kind of that dedication to the customer and to the business.
As we talked about earlier, I have been to a few different places now in my career. I’m really fortunate. I don’t know if I’ve ever been anywhere where the cultural mindset and the dedication to the customer have been as strong. From day one, folks understand that we are really fortunate to be able to deliver service to a customer and that comes with a responsibility, right? It really, really does. And especially on the fiber side. Folks that are signing on on the fiber side are expecting to have high bandwidth connection 24-7, 365. It’s almost the five nines on the business side. The home customer is expecting that because of how unbelievably tied in they are, whether it’s home office, gaming, medical, or whatever it may be.
I’ve got a neighbor a couple of houses down from me. He works as a radiologist. And so he’s looking at all sorts of different stuff on his computer all day that have strong implications to the patients, right? And so that’s from his home. It no longer has to be at the hospital. And so we’re seeing that there’s an interest in the quality of that deliverable. And like I said, the business, folks just feel that way. They really, really do.
And it’s interesting, folks in discussions will push back. We’ll be in meetings. And it isn’t just, one of the executives has an idea and everybody just kind of turns that blind eye and says, “Yeah, okay, that’s fine. We’ll do that.”
There are really good and thoughtful discussions about how it affects the business at all levels. And so there’s that open, honest format for folks to engage. And like I said, it’s interesting how many people want to be the customer advocate, even inside of our own walls. It’s terrific, it really is.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, that is an interesting perspective. So you’re in this new seat, and you’re on this path of the company that’s growing and moving forward. What are some of the things that you’re excited about in 2024, some opportunities across the industry, but also as well for your own company?
Joe Pellegrini:
I’m very excited for 2024. I’ve been now allowed, with a new role, to kind of stem to stern from the closed one signature. It’s handed over to the group, and then we take it right there to the customer delivery and then long-term maintenance and hopefully happiness with the customer. But really for 2024, it brings us a little bit further down the path. We’ve jumped into five new larger markets around the Omaha area specifically. We’ve had multiple regulatory programs that are in full swing right now that we’ve either started in 2023, and we’ll finish in 24, or we’re starting, and we’ll complete in 24.
There are multiple other programs that we’re involved with too. So there’s a continued growth trajectory. Inside of that growth trajectory, we’re also working through our digital transformation, which is really how we build efficiency into the business. And that’s been my hallmark over the years is being able to continue to grow a business, but also take a really good look at the systems and the process and see if it’s actually working for folks. Because people can work really hard in swivel chairs all day long, but it’s not overly effective or efficient. And if we can give folks the right tools and the right processes to be efficient, you turbocharge your growth without really overly burdening the business and process.
So I think that’s what 2024 brings is the continued maturation. We’re continuing to grow or continue to bring more and more gig services to more and more of our customers. But also inside of our own walls, continue to be honest with each other and improve the efficiency of the business and the process. So yeah, 2024 is going to be an exciting year for GPC for sure.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, it sounds like you have a lot going on. I just want to dig into that digital transformation comment that you made. So this industry is a bit of a laggard, right? And as I said, there are a lot of hard legacy issues that need to be tackled. What do you think has motivated you all to embrace that transformation? And what have you learned as you navigate through it so far?
Joe Pellegrini:
I’ve been asked this question numerous times now. “Why would you spend money on a digital transformation or new systems, high-interest rates, slightly unknown or hesitant business landscape, whatever that may be.” And my response in general is, “Well, you can’t not.”
If we have a service that others can also deliver, then it’s really incumbent upon us to be the best we can be at the front and the back end of the service, right? So the upfront digital experience with the customer, engaging with them as efficiently as possible, ensuring that they can sign up quickly, and get their services. And then on the other side, make sure that the service is robust, up as much as it can, and built in a good, solid backplane network as well as a terrific physical network.
And so it’s interesting, you know, where some folks are pulling back for sure on these types of expenditures. We as a business felt it was actually incumbent upon us to continue to grow the business inside like that in terms of efficiency. That way the customer touch points are easier. It’s easier to bring those customers on board. And once they’re on board, they’re having a much better experience with us, whether it’s through their own type of portal or whether it’s the actual service delivered to their TV, whether it’s to their phone or to their computer. So you can’t not. That’s the coined answer at least.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah. Trying to be competitive, there are a couple of things: service delivery, customer experience, affordability, keeping your op-ex down so that you can provide great services at the right price, and there’s consolidation looming, right? So people see the value in being able to aggregate networks, but a lot of those low op-ex, the ability to aggregate networks, really comes down to the data and the system level, the stuff that you’re talking about. So I do think it’s important for operators to tackle those hard problems while it may feel expensive, but I think it unlocks a lot of value in the future. Does that make sense?
Joe Pellegrini:
Absolutely. If you’re taking a solid look at the business and who you are, like we spoke of earlier as well, we understand we want to be a high-quality carrier. We’re not just going to grow to grow. We’re not just going to put push pins on a map to say that we’re there. If we say we’re going to engage with that local community, we’re going to engage with that local community on an enterprise and a wholesale side.
And we’re going to try to deliver to those towers and work on the fiber to the home piece. We’re going to work that asset, because, to your point, it’s an extremely expensive asset to build, whether it’s the actual electronic network side or the physical network side. The cost of capital and the cost of delivery and the timeframe associated, are large numbers, right? They are and they can get huge fast.
And if we say we’re going to go in and be a part of this community and engage in all these different levels, then we know we’re making a good decision for the business, as opposed to just, like I said, trying to be a little maybe a little less strategic. Getting those marketing splashes here and there is nice, but if you can’t then engage with that community and deliver in a timeframe, it’s really falling on deaf ears long-term. So you lose your credibility. And that’s one thing Great Plains has across its footprint is terrific credibility, because every time over the years, they said they were going to come into an area, they did and completed the project, whether it’s regulatory or their own cost capital and have succeeded in each deployment, which has been great.
Pete Pizzutillo:
You’ve been listening to the Broadband Bunch. This is Pete Pizzutillo. And we’ve been speaking with Joe Pellegrini. He is the President and Chief Operating Officer of Great Plains Communications.
Joe, you just mentioned a really interesting term there about credibility and reputation, right? And I know you all have been able to secure public funding and you mentioned a bit about developing a reputation at that regulatory level. What does that look like? How does somebody earn that in your opinion?
Joe Pellegrini:
Wow, I would say time, right? So we have a terrific policy team led by Ken Pfister and John Barrett. And they bring many decades between the two of them. And then we also have two other folks on the team as well. They bring so much experience and time working with the regulators to the table that it enables us to have a really deep understanding of what the timing and the policy is all about, right? A lot of folks, we read about it all the time, things get thrown out, whether it’s a bill or it’s a new piece of policy or whether it’s something along those lines. Is it actually good for business now? Is it good for the customer now? And Is it going to be good for the customer five or 10 years from now?
And that is really where I believe we punch way above our weight in terms of a business because we have a policy team that engages long-term. They try to either help the policymakers or engage with the consortiums that are working with the policymakers to say, “Yes, you have those dollars available today. Will those dollars be available 4, 5, and 10 years from now to continue to deliver on that guarantee to the customer?”
And so it’s ensuring that that group is not short-sighted. And that’s, I would say, the real powerful difference that they bring is how long they’ve been in policy and the understanding that you can check a box for the 2024 budget for the state or for the federal policy piece. But is it going to be effective in 2025, 2026, 2027, and 2035?
And that understanding helps us even as a business make good decisions because they can come and sit with us and give us a little bit more of a roadmap. And I would say there are a lot of companies out there that may be struggling with that roadmap. So we as a business can then build a longer-term budget, delivery policy, or whatever that may be, associated with the regulatory piece. So we’re mixing very nicely our growth with our own capital with the regulatory piece and the commitments associated with those.
Pete Pizzutillo:
I have a question about BEAD. There’s all this pent-up frustration and anticipation around it. So is BEAD the only avenue that you guys are looking at? Where else should people be thinking about partnering with public money and public funds?
Joe Pellegrini:
Yeah, great question. I think BEAD is the one that gets the most airtime right now. But underneath BEAD, I mean, for us, whether it’s Broadband Bridge, some of the USF programs, AKM, e-AKM, or Next Level that we participate in. There’s a reverse auction we’re jumping into today. There are a few others that we’ve been working on early this year already. There are a ton of really good policy and regulatory programs out there associated with delivering good high-bandwidth services, specifically to rural America.
And where BEAD may get a whole bunch of press, there are still a lot of dollars flowing that support those folks who don’t have access. And so, like I said, where BEAD may get some more of the press, there are a bunch of other programs. I would say for all these businesses out there. Get creative and look into how your state and the federal government are supporting the constituents and the customers inside of your footprint. There are a lot of other programs that maybe don’t get as much press, but they are just as effective for the customer on the other side as what we’re hoping BEAD is. I mean, we’re hoping BEAD, obviously, is a step in the right direction, where RDOF struggled. We’re hoping BEAD is administrated in a much more robust fashion.
But yeah, there are a lot of good programs out there that I think folks may not engage in as thoroughly as what they’re going to do with BEAD. And for us, a really good understanding over a lot of years of all these other regulatory programs that we participate in, in what the rules and regulations are, the funding associated with them, and then the commitment to the customer on the other side. When and if we do participate in BEAD, I mean, no issue whatsoever with us being successful in terms of our deployment, because of all the other programs we have successfully participated in before.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, I do think BEAD is kind of a blessing and a curse. In some ways, it’s good to get that money, and it shocked the system. So folks that weren’t pursuing public funds kind of put the agency together to go after those BEAD funds, hopefully. But to your point, you can point that capability now in a lot of different directions, and there’s money that’s flowing quicker, potentially, than others.
We talked a little bit about consolidation, right? And you guys have gone through a handful of acquisitions, I believe, in the last few years. What’s on the horizon for you guys, and what do you think is going to be the temperature of operators to acquire or to be acquired in the next, say, this next year or so?
Joe Pellegrini:
Yeah, GPC has been really successful over the last six or seven years. I believe we made five separate acquisitions and integrated everybody, the people, the assets, and the systems successfully over time. And everybody knows when you do make the acquisitions, once you look under the hood, there are a couple of issues and problems here or there. But you also are really fortunate to get some terrific folks with a background of that specific business, the asset associated, and the customer base with that.
So it opens up all sorts of different opportunities. And we’ve been able to take some of those assets and then expand, whether it’s our MDU program or our enterprise program or wholesale program, into those, maybe more perennially fiber-to-the-home-based systems. So it’s been creative to us across the board. It really, really has. And we definitely will continue to have an eye toward bolt-on acquisitions, as well as things that are more sizable as they come down the road.
But right now, really, for us, it’s continuing with that digital transformation that’s going to enable us to continue to integrate if we choose to. So, I mean, there’s an organic piece. Still, that inorganic piece is attractive. You guys have talked to some of the folks over the years. There has been, with the cheaper interest rates over the prior four to six years, a grow-to-grow reason, right? It wasn’t grow because we wanted to, should, or even could at that time. It was grow for any reason. And they took down some serious debt along the way. And that debt has more than doubled over time.
So, you know, companies that were paying 50 million in debt service are paying 100 million now. And they’ve taken down no new debt, right? So you’re going to see that erode into businesses’ ability to be functional for their customer base long-term. I think you’re going to see them come to market sooner than later. And we’ll obviously be looking at any and all of those that fit with who we are as a business.
But, like we’ve talked about in the earlier part of the podcast, really, with GPC understanding who we are, it enables us to look at businesses that some fit and some don’t, right? Just because something’s for sale in our cabbage patch doesn’t mean we’re going to jump right in and buy it. It has to really fit the mix of who we are; how we deliver our services; and what that commitment to the customer is longer term.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, and I liked what you said earlier about people, assets, systems, and service delivery is kind of the considerations around looking for targets or setting yourself up instead of just looking at the geographic layer, location, plus the network assets. How do you round out that thinking about how we operate; who are we as a company; and how our systems fit together? I think that would be kind of a more logical way to move forward in terms of potential acquisitions or preparing yourself for acquisitions.
Joe Pellegrini:
It is. I would say that the one thing I get to offer the businesses I’ve been a part of, and obviously GPC now, is I started as a splicer in Hartford, Connecticut. I mean, I was on the lead underground crew. So I was working with torches every day and opening lead sleeves and toning paper cables. So it was a very old system in that downtown area. And as a junior splicer, you got put on the crummiest jobs, right? But I learned a ton from some really smart folks.
What it’s allowed me to do over the balance of my career now is understand that there is time, energy, logistics, and weather associated with decisions. So we can sit around tables with spreadsheets now and move numbers to the left or to the right or up or down. But there’s an implication for the business. There’s an actual tactical piece to the business to say, “Yeah, we want X amount of this.” Well, it’s going to take also time, energy, money, deployment, or whatever that may be.
So it’s been nice for me over the last 15 years or so years of my career as I’ve continued to work my way into that side of the business to understand that we can slide some numbers around. But, you know, at the table, I can help explain to folks that it’s not just sliding the number from the left or to the right. There’s really a logistics piece, a tactical piece, and a timeframe piece. Executing some of these small moves on a piece of paper is actually fairly extensive.
But if we can be honest about how extensive it is and the timeframe associated, we can plan as a business. And that way, we’re not missing or underperforming because we knew on the front end what it was really going to take. And so just really having a little bit more of a more holistic look at the business as opposed to just the financial is really how I think we continue to succeed moving forward.
Pete Pizzutillo:
So if you could go back in time and talk to the young Joe the Splicer in the underground caves there, what kind of advice would you share with them?
Joe Pellegrini:
I would say continue to learn as much as you can from as many people as you can. I see a lot of folks get pretty excited about somebody with a title and want them to be their mentor or something like that. But almost every person you come across daily, you can learn something from. I work with guys down in the manhole structures. If you sit down there for six hours splicing paper cable with somebody, you learn about them, their family, and their career. And you continue kind of putting all those pieces together on how they got to where they are and how they’re succeeding or struggling in life and with their careers.
So really just continue to listen and enjoy the journey. I would say that is another thing. Just enjoy the moment in time as much as you can as opposed to hurrying up from place to place to place. I think a lot of us struggle with that, not just career, you know what I mean? I’ve got a junior in high school. And watching the hockey game yesterday, enjoy the moment in time. You know what I mean? Enjoy that I’m there to be able to experience that with him. So for my younger self, I would definitely ask myself to slow down a little; be in the moment a little more; and continue to just listen and learn from as many different people kind of in my orbit as I could.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah, I love that. That’s great. You have a future podcaster in you right there. All right, so looking ahead, say, 24 months, where do you think we as an industry are going to be doing just fine? And where do you think we’re going to fall short in terms of closing this gap and taking advantage of all this opportunity in front of us?
Joe Pellegrini:
Yeah, I’m hoping that the idea around broadband and the delivery of broadband doesn’t get swept aside with the next news cycle. COVID really brought it forth, right? And we all engaged. We really, really did. I’m hoping that the next news cycle or interesting thing doesn’t push it aside, specifically on the regulatory side, as being not as interesting as something else. I am hoping, obviously, it’s not some major geopolitical issue that pivots us in a different direction. But it’s kind of come of age. We’ve got BEAD coming down the pipe. There are multiple other programs. There’s a lot of private capital that is willing to be deployed intelligently in terms of successfully deploying broadband and then kind of selling and building a business case around that.
But yeah, I’m hoping that the focus can stay on the positive engagement with the industry and the ability for us to deliver. And I think, honestly, and maybe you’ll disagree with me, but I think one gig speed for homes is good. We’re already delivering two gigs. I’m not saying that we’re not engaging at a high level as well, but you’re seeing four, six, eight, and 10 gig speeds to the home. And there’s an equipment cycle that goes with that that’s extremely expensive. There’s a purity of the network that has to be there to deliver because then your backlink has got to be 100 gig or 400 gigs, right?
So it will be interesting if we can at least understand what it takes to deliver 1 gig speeds to a lot of rural America as opposed to someone just checking off that in my tier 1 city I can get 10 gigs, why can’t I get 10 gigs in my rural space. So yeah I would say more access to 1 gig speeds over the next few years and honest conversation about what we really need to deliver to those customers and hoping we can continue the focus on how positive broadband is for folks to have in their homes as a way to ensure that whether it’s a home business, gaming, or schooling it opens up so many more opportunities for a family from two years old to 100 years old. It really does.
Pete Pizzutillo:
Yeah. I think you are right. The reality is that if you can’t afford one gig, what is the point of having 10? So we need to get this thing done at the right quality at the right price.
Joe Pellegrini:
You are right. We have had a lot of good experience with pricing and how to create a product that is needed and can be afforded. So I think that we do a really good job at that. Some of the pricing even inside of our own areas for our competitors is extremely high compared to ours. And we are still able to do it effectively and make money. So sometimes we look at how other operators are running theirs and the prices that they are charging. We feel like sometimes they can be a little egregious. When we price, we price to where we need to be as opposed to what we think we can get from the customer. And it really creates a much cleaner business for us. And then hopefully a customer that comes with us enjoys the product and stays with us long term.
Pete Pizzutillo:
I agree. Joe, thanks for joining us. How can our listeners learn more about Great Plains Communications?
Joe Pelegrini:
Check out our website at GPcom.com. It is a terrific website. It gives a little bit of the history of the business as well as all of the different products that we offer. To the folks who are listening, I appreciate the time that you spent listening to us talk. But I will leave you with, GPC is a full-service operator which is one of the things that the team and I are very proud of. So it is not just a fiber to the home or a legacy business. It is the wholesale, the tower, the enterprise, and the partners.
So when we decide to be a part of a community, we come in and support the entirety of the community not just a single business or homeowner segment. And so it is extremely satisfying for us to be a part of so many communities across our footprint. Visit our website. If you have any other questions, there are phone numbers and emails there. Let us know what we can do for you.
Pete Pizzutillo:
I appreciate that. Thanks again, Joe.
You have been listening to another episode of The Broadband Bunch. If you enjoyed this episode, please be sure to subscribe or rate us. You can also follow us on our social handles or at broadbandbunch.com. Thanks again for listening. And thank you, Joe. I see you all next time.
